Collective Spirit Podcast
First Peoples Fund presents the Collective Spirit® podcast. The Collective Spirit moves each of us to stand up and make a difference, to pass on ancestral knowledge, and simply extend a hand of generosity. The Collective Spirit podcast features Native artists and culture bearers who discuss the power of Indigenous art and culture. The Collective Spirit® podcast is produced by First Peoples Fund, whose mission is to honor and support Indigenous artists and culture bearers through grant-making initiatives, culturally rooted programming, and training & mentorship. Learn more at www.firstpeoplesfund.org
Collective Spirit Podcast
S3E5: Shaarbek Amankul, Clementine Bordeaux, Heidi K. Brandow
This episode is the second part of our two-part series on Global Indigeneity and the role of art. We’re featuring a conversation with Shaarbek Amankul, a multidisciplinary Indigenous Kyrgyz artist and the founder and director of the Nomadic Art Camp. Established in 2011, the Nomadic Art Camp was created to connect artists from around the world with Central Asia's rich art, culture, and landscapes, with a special focus on Kyrgyz traditional nomadic life as a source of inspiration for contemporary, globally relevant art practices.
Joining Shaarbek in this conversation is Sicangu Lakota artist and scholar Clementine Bordeaux, who grew up on the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. Clementine holds a PhD from UCLA and is also involved with Racing Magpie, a Lakota-centered arts and culture organization based in Rapid City, South Dakota. Finally, you’ll hear from Heidi Brandow, a Diné and Kanaka Maoli multidisciplinary artist and current Associate Director of Communications at First Peoples Fund. Enjoy this episode, and we invite you to visit the companion blog, which highlights first-hand experiences from the inaugural cohort of Native American artists at the Nomadic Art Camp in Kyrgyzstan and support the Nomadic Art Camp GoFundMe campaign to ensure this critical engagement between Indigenous people continues.
You know, this is such an amazing time right now for Native people to be alive. We are really living in such an amazing time and we have to take a moment to really feel that. We have to know that, we have to talk about it, we have to acknowledge it and I think to have these conversations about the possibility of hosting exhibitions that highlight these collaborations between global Indigenous folks is really powerful and that we really need to be a part of this momentum that's happening globally. First Peoples Fund presents the Collective Spirit Podcast. The collective spirit moves each of us to stand up and make a difference, to pass on ancestral knowledge and simply extend a hand of generosity. The Collective Spirit podcast features Native artists and culture bearers who discuss the power of Indigenous art and culture. Hello and thank you for tuning in to the Collective Spirit podcast.
Speaker 1:This episode is the second part of our two-part series on global indigeneity and the role of art.
Speaker 1:We're featuring a conversation with Sharbek Amankul, a multidisciplinary Indigenous Kyrgyz artist and the founder and director of the Nomadic Art Camp. Established in 2011, the Nomadic Art Camp was created to connect artists from around the world with Central Asia's rich art, culture and landscapes, with a special focus on Kyrgyz traditional nomadic life as a source of inspiration for contemporary, globally relevant art practices. Joining Sharbek in this conversation is Sichangu Lakota artist and scholar, clementine Bordeaux, who grew up on the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. Clementine holds a PhD from UCLA and is also involved with Racing Magpie, a Lakota-centered arts and culture organization based in Rapid City, south Dakota. And finally, you'll also hear from me, heidi Brandau, a Diné, and Kanaka Maoli, multidisciplinary artist, 2018 First Peoples Fund Artist and Business Leadership Fellow and current Associate Director of Communications at First Peoples Fund. We hope you enjoy this episode and invite you to visit the companion blog on the firstpeoplesfundorg website, which highlights firsthand experiences from the inaugural cohort of Native American artists at the Nomadic Art Camp in Kyrgyzstan camp in Kyrgyzstan.
Speaker 2:Thank you very much, Heidi, for inviting me to this interesting meeting and thank you to Clementine to join us.
Speaker 2:And I'm very happy to talk about this because for many years I was trying to get in contact with Native American artists and this year it happened. My interest was always to get to find some similarity and differences between our different communities from Kyrgyzstan and America, and now I'm always asking myself if the DCBC, our old history, and during this nomadic art camp I saw some similarities in feeling connection to the nature, to the earth, to the traditions, which was for me very interesting and this is why I think the artists from different continents, from America and from Central Asia, especially from Kyrgyzstan, we try to develop kind of cooperation and collaboration for long term and giving this possibility also for many other artists, including new generations. And I would like to ask you what do you feel when you were in Kyrgyzstan? What did you feel when you were in Kyrgyzstan? How was your time in Kyrgyzstan when you met local people and you see nature, you see how local people, community related to the land, to nature, to animals, to the life, and what was?
Speaker 3:your impression. My biggest impression of being in Kyrgyzstan was the rural aspect of it all. So I grew up on a tribal reservation in South Dakota which has maybe 10,000 people that live in a very large space of land in the northern plains of what is now the United States. For me there was a lot of similarities. Even though I didn't know the language and I've never been to Kyrgyz communities, it felt very familiar to me.
Speaker 3:Where I grew up, you have to drive very long distances to get anywhere. There's a lot of kind of laid back communal space and experiences and exchanges across families, and so I think, aside from culturally, there are some differences, but I think being on the land and traveling you know we were driving hours every day to see different things it reminded me of just being back on my tribal reservation and and I think I've been processing a lot since we returned home of thinking about being nomadic, more so as a mindset and not necessarily, you know, because so many of our communities are turning to urban spaces and moving to cities and in a place like the United States right, I think over, I think it's like 60% of tribal people now live in cities I think we have to start thinking about being nomadic as a, as a mindset, and being able to travel a lot and visit different people and experiencing different things across distances, but still carrying who we are as tribal people. And so my impressions were that it felt like home in a particular way, because that's how I grew up and being able to just go from place to place, travel long distances, but also just everywhere you know somebody and everywhere you're like meeting old friends or meeting new relatives, and I think that's kind of what it felt like to travel with you Sharbeck is I've you would just roll up to someone's house and be like we're going to talk about this and we're going to do this and I I just felt like I was traveling with a relative that was taking me to visit like all his cool friends, and that's why I feel like, when I come home, like I'm going to visit family or friends, and sometimes I'm going to new places on different reservations or in different tribal lands. That's how it felt for me. It felt very familiar.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would agree and I would say you know I was writing about some of this. Schaubach had asked for a response and I was just looking at it again and the vastness of the land and sort of witnessing communities and people living in these rural settings but also tending to their livestock also was very familiar because, like you, our homelands are also similar, was very familiar because, like you, our homelands are also similar. I think Navajos in particular, we don't live like Pueblos in that we live far away from each other and I often you know, because in Hawaii it's also very much the opposite and Pueblos primarily. So I resonate a lot with these more communal settings but seeing that also reminded me of the Navajo Nation and sort of how we are so distant from one another in these like vast settings. But seeing that also reminded me of the Navajo Nation and sort of how we are so distant from one another in these vast landscapes, but also feeling like this deep sense of freedom and belonging to the land among the people maybe not necessarily for myself and that the stillness and that quiet freedom felt like a form of resistance in and of itself and I also really love what you mentioned about that.
Speaker 1:We have to, to some degree, adopt this mentality of being in this kind of nomadic mindset. So, whether we're being nomads by our own choices or if we're being forced to relocate for economic reasons, I think one of the things that we're experiencing a lot in our Native communities is having to leave for jobs, sometimes maybe leaving for opportunities like school. I think, more and more now we're also seeing globally the necessity of having to be nomadic because of climate change. So our world is changing and, in fact, this necessity of adopting or being part of nomadic society, I think, is a very relevant conversation.
Speaker 2:Okay, thank you very much. You know, in this project, which is a critical ingredient of this project, it was used in a traditional nomadic way or life of the current nomads in the Naren area and in the Sikulia area, the Kyrgyz nomads in the Naryn area and in the Sikulia area, which is in the Sikulia lakes, and as a source of inspiration for contemporary art practices. So this was why we visited different places and Kyrgyz culture is normally related to the horse culture. Without horses, kyrgyz is not Kyrgyz. This is always with horse. So, and this is why people in Kyrgyzstan still using the nomadic way, when this is, especially from springtime to autumn time, they go to pasture, to the high mountain with a lot of animals, and you saw a lot of how many animals there from different horses, cows, yaks, sheep, goats.
Speaker 2:In this project, I try to focus that this nomadism is not solely viewed as a physical journey, but also as a metaphor for life, ongoing exploration, symbolic discovery, change and growth. This is why it is very important for artists to feel this and understand, to get inspiration from these new places, from new territories, and I hope, of course, that you, when you are staying in Romantic, you are fully equipped for individual art projects. I hope, of course, that you, while you were staying in nomadic youth, were looking for individual art projects and exploring local nature and this rich history, spirituality and heritage, including traditional nomadism, shamanism and, you see, nomad, soviet and modern capitalistic culture which is now as a Kyrgyzstan. And what was your biggest inspiration? What you saw there during nomadic camp in Kyrgyzstan and what you can remember, what touched you?
Speaker 3:for me.
Speaker 3:You know, we did have all these experiences across these different territories and our artistic and creative practices and, honestly, my well, aside from the eagle, of course, meeting all the eagles was very profound and beautiful, but I have a really intimate connection with rocks, so being able to see the different mountains and land and the rocks that we've met along the way while I was there I don't know if I might have shared this with you, heidi, but I know I don't think I shared this with you, sharbeck, but I was having dreams of bringing rocks from my home to Kyrgyzstan, and so for me, that was the, and I've been thinking a lot about our relationship with rocks and stones and cause we have here in my community we have a lot of conversations and stories about our creation and how we come from stones and we come from rocks, and so being able to see the land in that particular way and to hold rocks and to be and to see the art also that was reflected in from the magic stones and the rocks there was really really profound for me and it has has been something that I've been thinking about a lot, and so I just I love rocks and I know that probably sounds silly to non-tribal people, but they're so important to us and I know they're very important to you all too so that for me it was being able to just see the land and be a part of the land.
Speaker 1:You know, I can't remember which number of day it was, like what day it was in terms of was it the fourth day, was it the fifth day but I know that we had stayed in the village home and I remember Sharp Ek had asked us at dinner what was the most touching thing so far, like what is your impression of our experiences so far on this trip? And we were all kind of going around the table and like sharing something at the table and I remember that I felt overwhelmed with emotion in that moment, just because, like I know that up until that moment I think we had been to Tashrabat, naran and so on and we had just gotten to Issyk-Kul. But I think the most touching thing for me at that moment and it really kind of stuck throughout the entire duration was, I think it was the land and witnessing sort of, the vast expanse of the land and not to over-romanticize the people who are living in these rural areas, but to see the still like close relationship with these animals and also just sensing you, sharpek, as our host, a deep sense of pride in sharing these things with us and I feel like that, those thingsck, as our host, a deep sense of pride in sharing these things with us and I feel like that those things combined, they're really powerful. It also made me think about a lot of things we have lost in my own community, seeing, for example, like this relationship with horses.
Speaker 1:A week before I had left the country, there was a story in the Navajo Times which is like our Navajo Nation newspaper. There was a story in the Navajo Times which is like our Navajo Nation newspaper and they were talking about horses, wild horses and how on the Navajo Nation there's a lot of wild horses right now, to the extent that it's almost becoming like a problem. And so they interviewed all of these like rancher guys, just people in the community. And I remember reading this or seeing this guy's response and he's a rancher, he's Navajo, and he was saying that he was upset that people were siding with the horses because he was like these people. They don't understand the kind of problems that these horses are creating because they don't live here every day. They shouldn't comment on it and they shouldn't have an opinion on how we decide to take care of this problem. Quote, unquote problem which is to imply that his solution is that they kill these horses. And this is a guy from my own community.
Speaker 1:So to see this, it just made me think, like how we've lost these waves. So, in fact, the horse is not the problem. The problem is that we've lost this connection. So, in fact, the horse is not the problem. The problem is that we've lost this connection to understanding how to live with the horse and how to work with the horse on our lands, and so I think that was part of the witnessing all of this. I think that's I could even get emotional now. I could cry, because these are real issues and these are things that are happening every day.
Speaker 1:And you know, and you also talked about us visiting these eagles, right, and we were so fortunate to visit them not once, but technically like three times. And I know, sharpek, probably this could be like maybe a novelty thing for you, because it's so like a regular part of Kyrgyz people and culture, but again, I mean, this is also for us so exciting because we also have lost this closeness with these animals, like we have a closeness in our heart, but I mean the closeness of, like this guy, the first one, I remember he had the eagle close to his face, you know, and was basically nuzzling the eagle and to see this kind of exchange, it's really touching. Perhaps being a part of these types of exchanges, or this one in particular, is important because I think it reignites that type of recognition and relationship with the land and with people and animals and so on.
Speaker 2:What similarities do you see between the history of Native Americans and Kyrgyz indigenous people in terms of their relation with the land and especially, of course, with the similarities between artists, because we represent our cultures and during this time, did you see some differences or similarities between, especially between us, between artists or between persons?
Speaker 3:In our time in Kyrgyzstan, I saw many similarities between artists from Kyrgyzstan and I also saw potential in. What I'm interested in as an artist myself and as a scholar is kind of this everyday exchange that we have with art in our life and the way that we utilize creative practice to communicate our relationship to a particular place. And so I love the everyday. So seeing the eagle hunters show up with the eagle, like chilling in the back seat with the dog in the trunk, but then you know they get out and they like have this beautiful demonstration with their eagle. But I love those moments of just the everyday. Or you know, as Heidi said, when we, when we went to visit to try to set up a time to meet with the eagles, and we got to see there was what like three or four of them and we were all just in awe of these eagles.
Speaker 3:For me, I feel art doesn't have to be extraordinary to be beautiful or connect us to place to be beautiful or connect us to place. And I think I felt that a lot in what we were experiencing while we were at the nomadic art camp. And I try to see that same thing in my own community. So often people who don't do not think of themselves as artists are the people that I'm most eager to talk to and to engage with. But also, I think, the everyday artist like going and visiting the studio and seeing the students come in and the students learning how to draw and the encouragement they were getting from the instructor I think for me those spaces felt again very familiar.
Speaker 3:But also just the everyday creation of art that would go inside the yurt or material culture that we wear. I love seeing those things in action that are also just. They don't have to be in an art gallery, they should be able to do both. And I felt that a lot in the artists that we met the Kyrgios artist that we met, and then that reflection that I saw in my own community of just like everyday people but they also are doing really beautiful, creative things that reflect land, that reflect culture, that reflect relationship, and so I saw a lot of those similarities. What about you, heidi?
Speaker 1:Yes, same, I think, also something that I shared briefly with Sharbeck, which I'll include here, because you're talking about these everyday things that often are. The value is diminished because it's like, oh, this isn't in a museum. I guess another form of that that was really touching to me too was food and the care that was involved in producing the meals. Every single meal that we ate together was made by someone's hands, like it was collected by someone's hands. It was made by someone's hands, and so everything was made with so much care and the ingredients were good and we ate well, like every day.
Speaker 1:To me, those kind of things are really high value and also a form of art. So to partake in something like that every day as part of our regular experience, I think was really touching. But I think the same level of care is expressed through food here and I think that's why I could see that and relate to it and really appreciate it, because it was something that I think is easily it's like invisible labor and it's something that maybe we take for granted, but it definitely wasn't. It wasn't lost on me. I was aware of the love and care that was involved in all the preparation and food that we partook.
Speaker 2:Thank you and I want a little bit to explain to you about Nomadic Art Camp because normally if you see how it's, local nomad people, pergis people, they go to mountain, to pasture, and from May till end of September and I also try to make this project from May till end of September and I also tried to make this project from May till end of September, so it's meaning we were in September. So in this case we didn't meet some nomads who living in nature with animals, there is no civil infrastructure, it was really wild nature, because already there was in some pool, was road closed because there was already snow. And its meaning, depending on season, nomadic Art Camp, if it will be May or June or July or August or September, it is different, different faces. Artists can see these different faces from nature, from people, from the surrounding, from land. And, for example, when we went to Bosovar pasture and then we go direction to this Tashrabat direction, you saw how many animals were there, how many horses were in the free land and I ask you, do you have some same similarity how this is in your land?
Speaker 2:You have also a lot of horses or a lot of animals, and this is animals just free, running, free, walking, and there are no people who are looking for them. They are just free, running, free, walking, and there are no people who are looking for them. They're just free. But this is not all, not in everywhere. This is only special places in mountain area, which is really a high mountain, where animals can get their food. And my question is do you feel something? That is, if you have something in your land, how are animals running free, or is this only from the past?
Speaker 1:I think it's like what I was talking about earlier, just using the example of horses and how our relationship, on the Navajo Nation at least, has shifted. You know where these wild horses there's a lot of them now becoming a nuisance to some people rather than communities seeing them as an asset and as a relative and as something that we might need to remember or reconnect with understanding our relationship. It just seems really fractured. So I can only speak of the Navajo Nation and in Hawaii. In Hawaii it's so messed up right now Our indigenous animals are really a lot of them are at risk of being extinct, and it's a really hard reality. But it's a reality that I think really mirrors what's happening to Native Hawaiian people in our own homelands.
Speaker 1:Initially, when Europeans arrived, my people were heavily impacted by disease, and so you know nearly 80%, if not more, of Native Hawaiians upon contact were lost to disease, and with that came the loss of culture, language, traditions, and you know so it severely impacted us in that initial encounter and ever since then, I think, my people have been struggling.
Speaker 1:Today, over 60% of Native Hawaiians don't even live in Hawaii.
Speaker 1:Most Native Hawaiians have had to relocate or move because of loss of access to land, economic reasons, maybe school, so many different reasons but the fact remains, which is that Native Hawaiians are not in Hawaii and therefore this is reflected in the plants that are endemic to our homelands.
Speaker 1:This is reflected also in the animals that are endemic to Hawaii as well. So all of this to say that I was very much inspired by Kyrgyz people and their relationship to animals and also just seeing the vast amount of animals, both wild and domestic, and kind of this ongoing connection and livelihood that's involved with living on the land and with these animals, because, you know, it's something that I think in my community is definitely we do have some things that are very hopeful and inspiring as well. Don't get me wrong, but I do think that the nomadic art camp is unique in the sense that it can provide that type of experience to incite that type of dialogue and this type of inspiration that I hope other Native folks can witness as well, so that we can all kind of take part of this experience and bring back that type of knowledge back home, because we really need this.
Speaker 3:And I think for the Northern Plains, we have a lot of domesticated animals. They're not free range in the sense of how they are, I think, in the more rural parts of Kyrgyzstan and there are efforts to try to build our relationship again with the bison, but right now a lot of the bison herds are managed or co-managed by non-tribal entities. And then we there's a lot ranching is such a big thing in my community when we were forced onto reservations after the signing of the 1868 treaty, there were ranchers and ranch families who settled the Dakota, the Dakotas, north Dakota, south Dakota, and they signed like hundred year, 99 year leases. So we have, like these white ranching families who now have married into our tribal communities but still have this mentality that they can just run their cattle on our lands. So there's a lot of tension, I think, of how our relationship is with cattle and then with horses.
Speaker 3:I think there's still a beautiful relationship with horses, but probably not in the free range that we saw while we were in Kyrgyzstan, cause I have a lot of family and friends who who raise horses and have really intimate relationship with with horses and we, you know, are a horse now are a horse community, but there.
Speaker 3:It it's not what it used to be and I think, with and like echoing Heidi and the devastation that's happening in Hawaii because of domesticated animals and domesticated people, I think, similarly, like we, you know, we have, like the black-footed ferret, we have animals that are on the verge of extinction in our territory or at risk of, like, very dire diseases. We have small prairie dogs that carry the bubonic plague and that's who the black footed ferret eats, you know. So there's this whole cycle of disease and, like Heidi said, I think it's reflected in people and definitely reflected in the land and our animal relatives. So I think we definitely are struggling to maintain those connections and, yeah, I agree with Heidi that there's so much to learn from Kyrgyz people and how they're able to sustain these relationships together.
Speaker 2:I want also a little bit talk about hunting, because when you saw this eagle, also, this hunter told us that they are normally hunting only in special time From spring till October. You cannot hunt because of children, little babies from these animals. Only from wintertime you can have some season where you can hunt and also, if it's an eagle, normally hunters let it free. After some years this eagle can get a family, can get a baby, of course, can produce freedom also. This is also important aspect which how people related to the nature, to the animals, to surrounding, because normally if you see how nomad people go to pasture and then bring yurt and then they go back and then bring yurt and then they go back, they're taking yurt. There are no buildings, no strong buildings. The animals are not destroyed. Everything you saw from animals, some things, all they're using for life, and there are no, no logical things.
Speaker 2:This is why us artists are also learning how, in old time, people are using this traditional wisdom, traditional knowledge, and this is, I think, important also for us, for artists to use this, to learn and to give this important aspect for the new generation that also can save this. And I saw also that American native artists using. I mean using or show in their artworks a lot of, a lot of sources from their cultural heritage, from traditions, and this is also important for me, because your art communities still have this feeling, a deep feeling for sources, and even if you have not some like in old time, free, where the animals can go freely around the different nature, your collective memory have this, that this artist as a transformer. They show this through their art. This is a very important aspect and, of course, for the future generation also, to find our own way in this contemporary art and about this solidarity and support between indigenous people globally. And I was thinking how to develop this idea and what do you think about this.
Speaker 3:I think there is a really important conversation that's happening right now between climate change, art and food practices. There are organizations globally that are trying to have this conversation and unfortunately they're not. They're just now trying to include tribal communities in those conversations. But I think this is the perfect time in the world right now to have this conversation about how we can brainstorm across communities I don't know what else to call it but to think through how we sustain our practice, our food practices and our hunt right, which would be considered hunting practices, but there are so many different communities right that hunt things that the rest of the global North probably thinks is wrong to hunt.
Speaker 3:I think about the whaling practices of the Pacific Northwest where, you know, in my own community, there's a huge resurgence of bison harvesting.
Speaker 3:We obviously don't hunt them how we used to hunt them historically, but we now can harvest an entire bison. Now can harvest an entire bison. And there are amazing I call them artists, but they're amazing artists and culture bearers who are figuring out what we do with everything in the bison from the bile to the heart, to the lungs, to the intestines, to the hooves, and so I do think there is a way that we can do this, and I think it's also tapping into the networks that already exist and just starting to ask those questions and ask how we can be a part of those questions and how we can be a part of these conversations, of this intersection I think of a changing climate and then tapping into this history and legacy of our own hunting practices and then how then to support each other. I think it's just trying to find the right conversation to have with the right people, but I think there are lots of opportunities to do that. Would you say that, heidi?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would agree.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think like right now is such a good time globally where I think a lot of us are eager to sort of shed all of this imperialistic, colonialist imposition on ourselves and on our people and really leaning into and recognizing our own autonomy and our power and our strength and reclaiming our voices and reclaiming our territories, reclaiming our language, our land and so on.
Speaker 1:I guess for me, one of the things that I can think of too, at least among Indigenous folks from, say, North America and Pacific, is, I think that there's also education, if you will, Pacific is, I think that there's also education, if you will, that needs to happen, and reaffirming or reasserting the fact that there are other Indigenous people, like in places like Kyrgyzstan, and that we need to recognize that and that we need to also be in solidarity with people who we might not necessarily initially recognize as Indigenous.
Speaker 1:And a lot of this is the result of having come from failed educational systems and it isn't a reflection of any type of inherent racism or superiority that folks might assume is the case. Truly it's because we've all, in the United States at least. Truly it's because we've all in the United States at least, had such patchy educational backgrounds. So, yeah, I believe that in order to strengthen these ties and to incite a larger conversation among global Indigenous communities at least in the communities that I'm from we also need to just be aware and create that awareness, and I believe a part of that is through education and through these types of cultural exchanges that the Nomadic Art Camp is creating.
Speaker 2:I was always thinking if, for example, nomadic Art Camp can be good for to develop and create collaboration between global indigenous people, because I'm always trying to find some example from different other countries, if there is some place or some project which can be like an example for where people can come and talk about this. Indigenous can come from different countries, indigenous communities, artists, and try to find way how we can develop our exchange. Also for me also question how we can continue the cultural and artistic exchange between Native American and the Kyrgyz artists. Of course in Kyrgyzstan it is possible that I will try always invite Native American artists. But do you think it's possible if you can develop, kind of say, nomadic art?
Speaker 2:It could be different name, but in American land, in some place in the desert, we can bring also maybe yurt or maybe build something and other things, but maybe could be a different model. That is, kyrgyz or different artists can go to America also and making more like a closer exchange. Also see feeling this place, feeling nature, feeling local indigenous communities and me talking with people. So it will be more close when people in different territories. They feel more clear and sensitive they feel more, more clear.
Speaker 1:It's.
Speaker 1:In sense, I do think this model that you've created is something that you could apply in many other places, and I think that other global indigenous communities, not just native americans, would be open or receptive to hosting a nomadic art camp in their own homelands, because you've created the model and it's like over 10 years old right, it's like 14, 15 years old.
Speaker 1:You have the framework and it's at the very basic sort of foundational level of understanding what this is. It's like. Really, you've created a space for people to come, to come together and to have conversations and to share time with one another, and in this respect, you're placing a more focused emphasis on Native people, on Indigenous communities, and as Native people here, we love to get together with each other and so, yeah, of course, I mean, I think that the model that you've created is something that can be applied in our own homelands and I think that that would be a really powerful and effective way of, on one hand, sustaining this relationship with Central Asia and with you and with Kyrgyzstan, but also in seeing how it can also evolve and change into its own thing right in these other homelands. I think it's a very realistic proposal. I think it's something that most communities would be interested in, and I think it's really beautiful.
Speaker 3:And there are I don't know how many different tribal nations in the United States and not including Canada, but I think yeah.
Speaker 1:Over 500.
Speaker 3:Yeah right, there's over 500 tribal nations, so I think we could get some folks on board that would want to host and bring Central Asian artists to visit our homelands. I'm also thinking back to when the hashtag no DAPL you know, the standoff against the Dakota Access Pipeline happened in 2016, 2017. There were Central Asian communities that sent yurts to the encampments at Standing Rock. So I think there's already this pull for this global collaboration, for this global collaboration, this global conversation about how we can support each other through artistic practices, through resistance, through just being relational, and I know there are so many people in my community that are in my own family. My uncle was like sign me up, though, and my mom was like they could put a year in our backyard, so she's everyone's very excited about the potential for this, for these conversations across the globe.
Speaker 2:Yes, I think it was a very good start this year project.
Speaker 2:I hope we can develop and create something more closer cooperation between our indigenous communities and especially we need to also include a young generation and because nomadic art can have also educational aspect, they can learn young people and anyway we need to give this knowledge to the young generation because they will continue what they are doing in a new way, with a new idea and with the global engineers, of course.
Speaker 2:This is very important because in this situation in the world climate change and this is different War and conflict everywhere we need, of course, we need to use our art In the everywhere we need, of course, we need to use our art. In the end, of course, we need to show this art in different places. This is why we are now trying to to get in central asia possibility for the future exhibition with you and with you also artists from the age of american artists in kyrgyzstan and in Uzbekistan and Kazakhstan, but it's, of course, need time and they need a little bit preparation, also responding, I hope, in America also. It is right what I telling? Or you see this differently, how you think?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean I feel like you know using art as a catalyst for initiating these conversations and sustaining them and also as a means for establishing relationships. I mean, you know this because you've been doing this work for so many years. It's a really powerful device and I think, obviously, that bridging this project with sort of a creative or artistic component and which could eventually lead to an exhibition or probably multiple exhibitions over time, I think is a really smart move. I think one of the things that came out of my time there, and especially in my conversations with Clementine, is really refocusing our obsession with Western markets, if you will, or the West in general, recentering this on communities such as Central Asia and, of course, in Indigenous communities, I think globally right now, in terms of Native art, we're really in a very unique period right now.
Speaker 1:I was telling a friend of mine when I came back from the Venice Biennale.
Speaker 1:Jeff Gibson is representing the United States and he's a Native artist and it's the first time in the history of the US and like our participation in the Biennale, that something like this has happened.
Speaker 1:And I was really proud and I came back and I remember having meeting up with some friends and just telling them. I'm like you know, this is such an amazing time right now for Native people to be alive. We are really living in such an amazing time and we have to take a moment to really feel that, we have to know that, we have to talk about it, we have to acknowledge it, and I think to have these conversations about the possibility of hosting exhibitions that highlight these collaborations between, say, central Asian artists and Native American artists and Native Hawaiian artists and global Indigenous folks is really powerful and that we really need to sort of be a part of this like kind of momentum that's happening globally, where, again, we're moving away from this dependence on and kind of reliance on, western models that are existing, that have always dominated art, and really asserting our own ways of knowing and understanding and moving about in the world. So, yes, I feel like this is a really great idea and I think it's something that's entirely possible and, yeah, I support this.
Speaker 3:I also think that, because we are in this I don't know what else renaissance, that we can have large global stages, but we could also I mean, I know so many community-based galleries across tribal communities here in the United States that would be more than happy to host Central Asian artists and have this conversation across tribal communities.
Speaker 3:And so I think there are so many opportunities that we could tap into again, just kind of leaning on our networks and finding the places that are really eager to have these conversations.
Speaker 3:And I have a lot of colleagues that are really interested in these global Indigenous conversations. And so you found us at the perfect time, sharbuck, to have these conversations and to tap into our networks. And I think there are a lot of us that are really ready to figure out how to break camp with the global north and set up our own camp together. And I think that's what we really need to work towards is to figure out how we can share camp and not worry so much about the West and their camps, but how we can ensure that we're supporting each other's camps and in whatever way feels good for us, so that we're not having to turn ourselves inside out to please someone that at the end of the day, doesn't really care about us, but I think we as tribal people care about each other in a particular way, so I'm excited about that potential of supporting artists in different spaces and and however that art might look.
Speaker 2:I'm also excited about that too yes, you are right, and because I I am happy that we have similar thinking and I feel like we have very good solidarity and we will develop in the right way indigenous issues and be with us and create kind of manifesto for these indigenous global issues, which I think will be very good for everybody who is thinking of still keeping these sources, these roots, these heritage traditions. Which is important is important.
Speaker 1:The Collective Spirit podcast is produced by First Peoples Fund, whose mission is to honor and support Indigenous artists and culture bearers through grant-making initiatives, culturally rooted programming, and training and mentorship. Learn more at firstpeoplesfundorg.